FAME, FEAR & FINDING YOUR POWER: NUMA PALMER EXPOSES THE TRUTH ABOUT MUSIC, LOVE & SUCCESS | W.A.R. Network

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Welcome home, welcome home. Today, my guests, Numa Palmer, singer, songwriter, producer, artistic director, television personality. She's worked with some serious names in international music, y'all, including Renato Zero, Adriano Solanto, Pino Danielle, Trevor Horn, and Phil Palmer. But today, I want the woman behind all that. The pressure, the ambition, the fear, the love, the things that never broke her. And what it actually means to become empowered when life is not cooperating. Numa, welcome home.

SPEAKER_00 0:37

Thank you to having me. We're very happy to see each other finally to have this uh this nice chart. This mode, it's not an interview. It's a it's a it's a lovely, friendly chart that we share with it with our audience, and we try to give some inspiration, so hopefully, and to share our experience with people that want to join us.

SPEAKER_01 0:58

Yes, ma'am, and I'm excited about this one. And I love your hair, by the way. I love the look, it's beautiful, I love it. And I did my homework so to say it's so the safe interview is officially over. So let's get it started. Yes, yes. Before we touch your career, take everything away. No records, no television, no collaborations, no Phil Palmer. Nobody knows your name. Who is Numa?

SPEAKER_00 1:25

Numa is an alien, it's uh a woman, and once when I was a girl, they always felt to don't really belong to this planet because the rules of this planet was too tough, too hard for her for her sensitivity, you see for for her heart. And so she managed to survive. And then trying to find um kind of mission, half mission, since I have memory of myself when I was a little girl. You know, when me getting, you know, in a primary school, you when you're a little girl, you know, you you go in the proper, you know, you're five years old, four years old, feeling too don't belong, and the kids they don't want to play with you, they don't want to meet you even. And um always on my own, uh, really literally in the corner, just left behind because kids didn't didn't find the same, you know, vibration. I was different. I born like that. I'm my mom knew that, and um, she raised me brave. She raised me, she was brave with me, she raised me brave. Um, she helped me to never give up to be myself, to trust myself, to trust my gut, to trust my my feelings, my visions, to improve uh what you can call talents or anyway inspirations. Um so I started immediately to try to um uh get close to people in a way to help. So I got a mission. I could read the mind of the feelings, you know, the feelings in the eyes, right? And uh and I was trying to help since I was a little girl, five, six years old, talking with people much more grown up than me, and say, hey, what's wrong with you today? I can feel this and this, and start to help with my energy. Then I understood that we go there, but the music and of course the art, and so this kind of expression could be quite healing, be very can go inside the heart of the people, you know, inside the soul of the people. So I found my way, but basically, still I'm an alien.

SPEAKER_01 3:33

And it's cool, it's cool to be different too. Now look at you, you're doing big things, and uh I'll before I want to ask you have you ever did a song or met? He's one of my favorite Andrea Botelli. I think that's how you know Andrea.

SPEAKER_00 3:47

I know Andrea, I know his wife, yes, and Andrea Kim is an amazing man, he's an amazing family, they are incredible. Uh, Andrea is a special alien, too, because uh, even though we know that he's blind, it's like uh he can see much deeper and much farther than any other people which have a proper sight. The wife is an incredible woman that devoted herself to Andrea for all her life, and he's a special, special person, amazing singer, of course, and incredible artist, incredible human being, very generous. He's so yes, it's a special, special guy. And I love that song.

SPEAKER_01 4:23

I love that song. I love that song, I love it. Yes, that's a beautiful song. Yes, yes, it's beautiful. Serenade, yes, yes, yes. I love it, I love it. That's so cool. So that's why I always like to begin because you know, public image can become another costume, and eventually, you know, people know what you do without knowing who the hell you are, you know. So I appreciate that, you know.

SPEAKER_00 5:01

You know, unfortunately, in most of the cases, people that when you get to know the people in their private life, you you get very disappointed. So it's not that usual, it's not that simple, easy to find a person that really um is like he wants to appear in his private life. I have a lot of disappointment. I met a lot of famous people that in their privacy were not that kind, honestly, to you. So that's why I decided just to don't follow any any idol, but just uh follow me. Follow my feelings, follow my heart. I um I know that I was different. I'm I'm vegan and I love animals, I love natures, and uh I became Buddhist uh 30 years ago, and so I'm I'm Buddhist, which which means uh that I believe in karma, which I believe I believe in certain kinds of prayer, I believe in energies, I believe that what you what you what you what you give you you receive back, what you do cause and effect. I believe that uh we have we are honored our destiny. I believe that the trouble is to teach us something and not to and even in the deepest uh despair, there is always uh light and always a lesson, which I honestly are not just words. It's what happened. I do what I do in my life every day, which I mean I don't I don't say things that then I don't do things that I'm saying. Right, yeah, because uh I I left my I lost my mother one month ago. I'm so sorry to hear that. And and there's been uh one of the most terrible shock of my life. I um I believe in what in that's that's as a sense uh to make sense on this. Um using this experience to evolve or help people that has the that that's there's some pain in their heart, any heart that any problem that they have, I'm there to help attract them to healing, through my music, to my my my presence. So once again, I don't just say that things that are which I don't do in in my real life, you know what I mean? I really believe what I'm doing. I'm I'm vegan. I am vegan. I don't I really don't eat animals. I really don't hurt animals, no one, not even a mosquito. It's my way to live, it's my belief. I mean I decided that I don't have to follow nobody, I have to just believe in what I believe and be honest to myself and be coherent, and in case eventually, if my life can be useful for someone as a beacon, as an aspiration, as anything, I will be honored to be uh helpful for someone else.

SPEAKER_01 7:36

Right. You sound like an amazing woman, and I'm sure you are a beacon for a lot of people. Do you have any insecurities at all?

SPEAKER_00 7:44

No, but not because I I tell you, explain you. I have fears as any other human being in the world. I mean, I'm a human, I have a fear of death. Although I'm a Buddhist, you know, Buddhism we believe in past life is in the in uh in the reincarnation, but I'm a human, I'm a flesh and blood. So I'm fear about the diseases or the pain of the death. But is the way I get through the fear and the worry, the worries maybe there are differences. I really believe that the universe is a is an intelligence that guides us. I really believe that when we connect us, we understand why, where, when, and all the information we need we need. Because I do every single day. When I feel lost, I go in my prayer and uh I say and I start to chant Namyo Horenge kyo, which is my Buddhist prayer, and I do also other kind of meditation, but mainly Nam Yohorenge kyo, but also other one, and I ask to the universe to guide me, to align me, to talk to me through people, through science, just simply what from inside my heart, even a voice in my head. I really believe that our life is all just tune our radio and our signal to to send and receive all the messages. When we are not good messages or violence or abuses which I had in my life, as much as I can a lot, I can promise you, is because unfortunately my radio was not tuned in the right station. So unfortunately, I was connected with that kind of violence, kind of abuse, security. There was a door that was open in my life. There was allowed a sabotage. And um when you don't feel non enough, when you feel don't deserve enough, to do worth enough. There is a phase, a phase of your life, especially when you're very young. Many questions cross your mind not to don't be enough, to don't deserve enough, to don't that the the very good things won't happen to you why they should. Right, right. And when you go and then you seem to the life wants to confirm you that you're right. So because your energy says this, so your vibration is this, and so you're always right because you because your energy matches. If you matches in despair, you're gonna get despair, I promise you. If you if you if if you if you vibrate in in fear, you're gonna have something to be feared. It's the loading universe. So it's very important that you go to you inside yourself to you into the energy of the universe if I say, wait a moment, I need to align my heart and my soul with the highest purpose. I really need to believe that there is something that for my good, for my health, for my mission, for for my best. I don't want to be connecting with such a such a pain and despair or fears or or disalignment when everything goes wrong. You start to say, Oh, wait a moment, what's going on here? Everything is against me. No, please slow down, go inside your heart, go inside your prayer, and ask to you ask to yourself to tune your heart and your mind with the universe, with the rhythm and the love of the universe. And I promise you that your vibration will change, and what comes in your life will be completely different. So it's not a matter of if you're worth enough, or if you're good enough, if you're beautiful enough, if you're clever enough, is the way that you tune in your heart and the and the love and the respect that you have for yourself and for the life.

SPEAKER_02 11:17

Right.

SPEAKER_00 11:17

Nothing to do how much uh how much you're a good singer or good uh doctor or good lawyer, good driver, good that's not it's not that. This is that one talent that you have and it's good to use it and use it for your life. Fine, it's okay. But it's something else that you have to connect with the with the with the universe, which is the love for yourself, the love for the for the life, and the respect for the life. When you are that humble and that connected, life just can just can all just can just help you. Yeah, not hurt you.

SPEAKER_01 11:49

I believe meditation helps a lot too with that, you know. Like, you know absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 11:53

I mean, people misunderstand the meaning of the meditation because people think that, I mean, people think I am busy, I have four kids, a little job, I work 12 hours per day. How can I possibly have and then have to go back and make it make the washing machine and wash dishes and then eventually go to bed? How? How can put this say then do um is a hobby? No, it's uh we need to change our mentality. If we don't understand that if we don't tune in our our mind and our heart in this kind of state of alignment, all that all that comes later will be a mess, you know, because you're not aligned, so aligned to your inner purpose. So if you feel frustrated, tired, worried, scared, because you didn't give to yourself the priority of the meditation, which means that moment for yourself which you really stay just in a space of your heart and a space in your mind, and you ask the universe to really give you, give the best for you, to put you in the right direction, to calm down, to breathe slowly, to give to yourself the moment of peace and faith that life will love you and the universe helps you. Okay? If you don't give your time, that the space of your no matter how many children you have, how many how many hours you work, and no many, no matter how much retired you are, you will be in a visual circus. If you change your priority, your priority, change this kind of rhythm in your life, and no matter what, at 10 minutes before the everything starts in your life, and the 10 minutes before you go to bed, you really decided that you need to center yourself profoundly towards this love and faith. Then probably you'll you start to be vibrated in a different way, and so the coincidences will be in your favor because exactly what you emanate it will be different. It's a signal, and so you you you will see that the work will be less hard. You know, I tell you something that makes you laugh. Maybe you would you think it's shallow, but I wanna say something stupid and stupid and shallow. You're gonna find even a parking. You wanna laugh or you wanna say something stupid and shallow? You're gonna find even the parking in a traffic jam. Because it's a rhythm, it's a synchronicity, and even that silly things, you know. You know, even that find the parking, arrive in time to your appointment, don't find all the all the reds like you think it's stupid. No, it's synchronicity. It's a part of it's a part of the bigger picture.

SPEAKER_01 14:21

So, so the the take me back to the traffic jam. I I hate traffic jams. I those are one of my that's one of my like I I I actually fear being in a traffic jam and being close to a a big truck, like a fueler, like trucks that carry gas and all that. I hate it, I hate it, I hate it. Like I'll start to take it.

SPEAKER_00 14:45

Start to chant, start to make a meditation, start to make a namyo ring eo, namyo ringo. Tina Turner was doing it. If you put Tina Turner, chanting a myo rangeo, she was doing nameo horenge kyo. She was doing other mantras, of course, but also and mainly, and mainly namyo horenge kyo. You will see that you change the vibration, the rhythm of your of your energy in your life because we pulse. We emanate energy. So we are honestly, is a is a quantum physics, no, it's no even mumbo jumbo. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_02 15:18

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:20

And then and then you start to have a different rhythm, and so that's and goes in the in different way, no, with the with the all around you, and you see that red light, uh, green light. The truck is is turning on the left, it's going away. I'm changing the GPS, so tell me the better to go on the right instead of the left. Why? Because their route is much is much more free. And you see to yourself, oh strange, what a coincidence. It's not coincidence, synchronicity.

SPEAKER_01 15:47

I'll try it. I'll try it. I'll let you know. I'll get back to you.

SPEAKER_00 15:50

I'm making another experiment. I'm making another experiment, for example. If you put in a in a room, um, you know that the machine that gives the time, tick, tick, yeah, yeah, tick metronoma. Yeah, I know, I know I don't know you say in in English metronomo is the inner.

SPEAKER_01 16:03

I know what you're talking about. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:05

It's one for when musician needs to have uh ta ta ta ta ta. So there is this thing about ta ta ta. So if you put um 11 called metronomo, I don't know in English are you are you called that? And they go all they all go in different day way. No ta ta ta ta ta ta ta after three minutes, everybody aligned everybody all together, even it they all they go in different time because is the is the the quantum physics, is is a physic that the rhythm call the rhythm call, the rhythm called the rhythm, so everybody will go in two minutes' time and I say rhythm. So, which is honestly such a strong proof of how we vibrate it, and how much is important that we get aligned with our inner purpose, inner voice, the child voice, because there is a child inside us, even if you're 80 years old, you know what I mean, 8-0, there's a child voice inside you forever and ever until the day you die. Right that's talking to you and tell you, I still love ice cream, I still love uh walking, walking on a barefoot on uh on the beach. I still would like to learn uh lasamba. I still would like to maybe buy that dress that I always thought that was too daring, and maybe people can laugh at me. There is still a child inside you that tells you things that you prevent yourself to being to do because what people think, or my mom or my grandmother, or my parents or my boss office, and and you need to listen the voice until it's not too late.

SPEAKER_01 17:44

I hear you, I hear you. I hear you.

SPEAKER_00 17:46

And that's why when you tell me, Are you insecure? No, I'm not insecure. I trust life. Sometimes I I fear something because I'm I'm flesh and blood, and when is that moment? I just pray, and then my fear goes my fear goes away.

SPEAKER_01 18:01

Goes away, yes, ma'am.

SPEAKER_00 18:03

So let me already know some of my inner child voice, you see.

SPEAKER_01 18:07

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:09

Yeah, yeah, I feel and and uh and everything as I the child inside me tell me that I still I am, nothing to do with my age, nothing to do with my wrinkle, has nothing to do with that. It's it's uh it's the child that is me that tells me you wanna dance, dance, you wanna sing, sing. You wanna you wanna um still have uh some uh ambition, ambition have it. I mean, as long as you don't you know you don't punch and kick nobody, you know what I mean? Until the competition that you have is with yourself and no nobody else, you know what I mean? Because I want to challenge myself every day, you know? That's me the only person that I want to challenge every single day. And that's what I wanted to do. And uh I would never give up to be a child.

SPEAKER_01 18:53

I hear you, I hear you, I hear you. Every I I still have that ch inner child in me, and I and I don't fight it at all, you know. So let me ask you something, Numa. You know, well, let me you were born in Rome, one of my favorite cities. You know, I wish to visit there before I die, and your official biography says you were drawn to dance, music, acting, and performing from childhood, right? Were you that kid, the the one performing for everybody, whether they asked for it or not, just getting on everybody's nerves. I was the child. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 19:28

I was the child. Dancing and singing in front of everybody no matter what. And I mean, uh probably, you know, in it in the early days, uh, before they really understood how to use it and how to make people amused and happy and um and to be inspirational for the people. Probably in the very beginning, people thought that I was just uh when you want to pay attention to everybody, you know, and when you want to be visit be be um be seen by everybody, you know, like I'm here, I'm me, you have to you have to see me, I'm here. But then I learned how to how to use this thing. Because I tell you what, we don't have to be worried, we don't have to be ashamed that we want to be seen. There's nothing wrong with that. We all want to be seen by someone else. We want this, you know, when I saw Avatar, that amazing movie, that beautiful movie.

SPEAKER_01 20:29

I just watched that with my son, the new one.

SPEAKER_00 20:32

Amazing. And on the very first one, the very first things that they say to each other, I see you. Which is which is when you're in America you say I hear you. You have this way to say beautiful way to say I hear you. And they say I see you, which means I see you. You're not invisible to me. I really see you. I I I see that you're alive, that you're in front of me, that you tell me something, that you express something, that you exist for me. We all want to exist. We all to we all want to be seen. So it's not a shame that everybody, and in this peculiar specific case, an artist wants to be seen. Because in return, it wants to it wants to give love, it wants to give amusement, it wants to give messages, it wants to give attention back, gratitude, and eventually music, and eventually, you know, something that makes you make you good feel good in your heart. So, anyway, isn't is a sh is a beautiful sharing. But I don't want to be ashamed because I want to be seen.

SPEAKER_01 21:39

So basically, what you're telling me is the family didn't have any peace. You were always performing.

SPEAKER_00 21:45

Yeah, yeah. I mean, my family just gave up on certain point to make me find a real job. You know what I'm when you say to the to the kid, find a real job.

SPEAKER_01 21:56

So, when did when did you first realize that you know you? Wanted to do entertainment. That what you were doing was actually entertainment. You wanted to do that.

SPEAKER_00 22:05

Three years old.

SPEAKER_01 22:06

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 22:07

Three years old. I was just jumping on the bed of my mom and my grandmother with a brush in my hands and just singing. And just stop in front of the friends of my mom and my grandmother and say, Hey, hey, hey, listen, look at that, look at that. I'm dancing and singing. Then I start to write songs. Then I was a disaster at school because instead of study Napoleon or something like this, I was writing all the lyrics of my uh um future songs. You know, guys, you children AI, we are children of the real music or the real composing or the real writing because we didn't have no even the cell phones. We now are in my time that that didn't exist.

SPEAKER_01 22:48

I was just thinking about that. Yep, yep.

SPEAKER_00 22:51

Or Wi-Fi that you can read and find things. We have just books that we need to look in for page by page. Uh I don't know what mean uh planet heart, and then you have to read because there was no information online, didn't exist online.

SPEAKER_01 23:07

You're so right, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:09

So we we we are we are we're born real artists, you know, with the hours and hours to study dance or study composition or study lyrics or or put together the ideas and create songs uh with the guitar and with the piano, learning instrument, understand music. I mean, uh we come from there. So I remember me in the early school that I said to study, that shouldn't be a good example, but this was the truth. And I was just putting together my future shows. And then when there was the moment of the you know the break, you know, the kids are going to eat something, I was just jumping in the middle of the corridor of the school and start to dancing. At the time there was the break dance, I remember, no? And so I started I started to put the music and all the with a little radio, you know, and start to jump in on the floor, rolling myself on you know on the floor. It was uh it was stronger than me. It was like you know, it's like a like a call. I don't know, like a picture you break dancing. You described obsessed.

SPEAKER_01 24:12

You said you you said something that caught my attention. You described growing up, it really caught my attention. You described growing up, growing in the business as a woman without people handing you opportunities, without relying on a famous husband, and without making compromises you didn't want to make. You also described the environment as deeply male-dominated and competitive. How ugly did that get?

SPEAKER_00 24:38

Horrible. I am I mean this uh this um environment is hopeful. And uh not just I mean, I'm talking about music business, but I believe that this is uh unfortunately uh the dark side of this planet, uh a dark side of certain humanity, of course, not everybody. Obviously, that we're not talking about everybody, we're talking uh just about about who is like this. So we don't have to put everything in the same pot. But we need to understand that this this side exists as huge and it's horrible. Be a woman and they want to make it, they want to succeed, they want to have a leadership because uh I'm I'm I'm a producer, I'm a writer, I am an owner on my on my team, and the boss on my team, which absolutely I love collaboration, I open to any kind of suggestion. All my collaboratory collaborators are like are like brothers and sisters for me. But I am the leader of my company. Full stop. Uh because I take also all the responsibility, by the way. This is uh, I mean, a woman. No, people don't lie down. Still, we we we think that our our our modern world, which um understands leadership also in politics and in many in many in many fields that we see women and they are achieved, not true. I mean, which means that that yes, there are very few and it and is a war. Because a woman has a leadership, but isn't nobody likes her. A woman that wants to succeed, why? Then what's she giving return? And if it's money or sex or power. That's not a way. Don't don't think that you you can you can you can go away from these things. And then which means that if you want to get away from this, you have to do suffer, fight. Most of the time, you don't achieve you you never achieve the very top or the top of the top because you cannot you cannot achieve that if you don't if you don't give money, sex, or poly or power politics. So you have to find your own way to make your own career, to find your niche, and survive and stay clean, as I did. But it's horrible. For all my life when I was a little girl, I just have sex abuse, horrible, black main, terrible, and overpowering. I I saw all the bad, all the nasty, all the dark side of the of the humanity, the possible that human being can see. Drug, prostitution, prostitution, blackmail abuses. I saw everything. And now that I am my age, I can say clear and loud. I'm not scared anymore. Because uh because uh this is the truth. And so for the older girls and women, men, I mean everybody they wants to succeed and still have the blackmail or the power, still they receive the abuses and and you know, and the torture, the mental torture, psychological torture, no, which uh they make you be believe that you're that close to achieve what you want to achieve, but you have to give your soul. I tell you, now that there is the the online thing, now that we have a little bit more uh it's not the freedom doesn't exist, it's a delusion. But in this uh complicated game and this huge motion, which is uh uh Instagram, uh Wi-Fi uh YouTube uh podcast and things uh we kind can try to make our own voice. We don't have to, you know, we don't have to step on the feet uh of the superpower because otherwise that is a delusion. Somehow we can now. It's not like in my time that that there was just four doors. If you don't pay your, you know, your tax, your duty on these four doors, there was no there was no other other way to succeed, okay? But now to the people that doesn't have a lot of money, that doesn't have a sponsor, that doesn't have uh a lot of hopes, they think, oh, I'm gonna do it, I'm gonna do what I'm gonna do. There has more chance. Be yourself, never give up, make listen your voice, make yourself visible, loud and clear, because there's someone out there, we have nine billion people on this planet, 100% is interested to you. You probably you have something that is good for that guy, for that woman, for that people. So don't give up because then from the moment that you accept the system, you accept the blackmail, you accept the abuses, and then you you bow, you know, you knee, you you you you you kneel on the system, your soul is lost. You will never get out of the system. You don't have to, you don't think that you do once and then you'll be forgotten. Once you inside the circle, the dirty circle, you will never escape anymore. Your soul is gone. It's a delusion thinking that you can do why once or twice and then you can escape. No, you never you don't have never allowed compromises, never allowed to give your soul your body if you don't want to, or money, or make it make make yourself overpowered, or someone and tell you they're not good enough because you don't do what they wanted to do. Don't do it. Never because now you can go online, make your voice and your face known. You're gonna find your personal audience without have owners.

SPEAKER_01 29:45

I love that.

SPEAKER_00 29:45

It becomes late.

SPEAKER_01 29:47

I love that. So when you so when you say you refuse to compromise, what compromises are you talking about?

SPEAKER_00 29:53

It's 90% of sex, but the the the most horrible sex possible. Because you know, it's not even a question, you know, to date maybe your future, I don't know, for one man, woman, whatever. I mean, in case maybe they would if he fall he fell in love with you, and yes, still uh you're still a black male, you're still uh, you know, abused, but if but it is what it is. No, no, you have to become a slave, sexual slave. You have to go to do parties, take drugs, wow, um have an orgy with everybody, friends on the friends on the friends on the friends, go in this party becomes the political guy, the power guy, the entrepreneurs, the people going on a yacht, go there, go there, go there. You have to do you have to become a prostitute, a slave. The sexual slave of the system. And this happened to me. I mean, this proposal is one it's happened to me for ages and ages. I used to go um on tour in a company. I was an actress, a young actress and singer, and the owner and main actor. One night locked, locked me physically in his bedroom. I didn't know how to escape. I started to cry and scream and then eventually escaped. I lost the job, of course. And uh I lost I lost any kind of job. My career went in pieces a thousand times. I lost the most beautiful cancer of my life to to make the important TVs, super important shows, record record company um contracts. I lost everything a thousand times and cried and crashed on the floor on my knees and in tears because um I I I I know I was there, there, there, there, there in an in a proper way. I uh study and um commit myself and work so hard and then find myself in the most horrible compromises, dirty parties, dirty requests, dirty black mates. But this, I mean, I can it's happened hundreds of times. I mean, it's a it's an it's I can tell you if we didn't have internet and and uh and um you know and my age and my um and my strength and my faith and so the way to keep my own image and my own stories, my own music, with my own uh lyrics, with my own um image, with my own uh uh because now once again online we can somehow choose our labels, uh, become independent. This doesn't exist, this didn't exist ten years ago, and uh make my own if make here my own voice. Um I mean I could I would I will never make it. I will never make it. Then eventually it happened also that um I had the the braveness to contact uh some very important musicians and pick up the phone and say, I want to collaborate with you, this is my way to write, this is my way to compose, this is my way to sing. So if you think that I'm good, well I I will have to have the honor to to work with you. And it happened, to tell you the truth, that uh some producers, some musicians, very, very famous, they said that I was very good. And they just um came work with me just because they like my way to work, not because I was a woman, beautiful, not beautiful, no sex, no money, no wife or whatever it is, uh nothing was me, just me. And that's uh that's uh honestly came you know later when I kind of have my personality, my strength, and my belief and my experience, of course, because I I I become I became good on my job as well, working very hard. And then I have the the braveness to pick up the phone and say, Hey, this is me, this is my music, this is my way to work. Do you want to produce with me? I don't have money to give you to to to too famous or too big. I can't get possible pay you. Yeah, can you can you can you play or even some great musician that was Steve Ferroni, that was one one of the most the most famous drummer in the world, the almost. If he played with Michael Jackson, I said, This is my song, I don't have money to pay you. Yeah, because would you all on honor me to to to play on some of my songs? And he heard it and said, I love that song, sounds great. I'll do it tomorrow.

SPEAKER_01 34:07

That's okay.

SPEAKER_00 34:08

You know, I mean, and that happened with Tre with Trevor Orange. Trevor Honor was one of the most incredible producers of the all.

SPEAKER_01 34:16

I've seen that on uh 6-2. That's what it's called.

SPEAKER_00 34:19

Which means yes, which means which is a is a game of words in Italiano, means uh say two, which is in English means uh uh um it's you. It's a game uh game of words in Italian, which means which means it's you, it's you. This is the translation in English. And I work with him with Renato Zero, who is English or American. Renato Zero is um our most important musician ever on the history of the Italian music. It's like uh our Elton John, it's like our Paul McCartney, to make you understand, no? And uh I work for him, and he's uh he's a friend of his a dear friend, and I produced uh some some of his songs, and I brought some songs for him. I had this great honor and trust without compromise, by the way. Um and then I produced with Trevor Arnor for Renato Zero, and and they both trust me, just and only because I was capable. You see, but this comes because you build your your your belief, your personality, also your skill, obviously. I mean you need to do you need you need to be good otherwise. I mean, it's a waste of time. Uh and so I proved to myself that uh you might you you m you you never, never, never give up.

SPEAKER_01 35:32

So let me ask you, let me ask you, Numa, when because you had we were talking about 6-2, right? You had Trevor Horn playing the bass, you had Phil Palmer on a guitar, and Steve Faron on the drums. Yes. Right? Uh like how the how did that session come together?

SPEAKER_00 35:49

Like he's lovely because they um friends uh and they know each other because they are colleagues, they cross uh they made uh made the most important music in the world together, so they know each other very well. So sometimes they are together on the same on the same studio, sometimes they work in their own studios and they sang their own tracks and their own recording. But we are um but we've been working together in many, many occasions because uh exactly, because you know, there are people clean, there are people talented, there are people honest, there are people they still love what they do, uh they still recognize talents to each other, they don't go in competition, they don't have problems with the women figures. There are someone in the world.

SPEAKER_01 36:29

Are you nervous? Are you nervous? Like when Trevor Horn walks into the you know walks on the record.

SPEAKER_00 36:37

No, no, I have to explain you what I feel like. When I work with the amazing people, uh once for all, uh Renato Zero, which is for us, it's uh God, basically, and um I am um interested. I am um, you know, all my ears and eyes and uh all my uh antenna you call no yeah, like I'm like uh you know, because I I want to learn everything. I want to understand everything. I want to I'm a sponge, you know. I want to absorb that beauty, the words, the talent, the energy. I mean, if I'm nervous, I I I will miss it. I'm uh enthusiastic, but also uh but super, super, super, you know. I wanna learn, I wanna listen, I wanna, I wanna I wanna absorb that, you know, that inspiration, that talent, that ideas, that words, that tips, and everything's going on in studio. I'm uh I'm super happy. I'm like, yeah, I'm super happy.

SPEAKER_01 37:38

Like, did you did you ever were you ever comfortable enough to say no Trevor? No, Trevor, play play it again.

SPEAKER_00 37:44

I mean, uh, I learned another beautiful things. These people are so amazing, so so powerful, so beautiful, so they they don't have they don't have the problem to prove nothing. Because more they big big and more they easy, because they don't have to prove. So sometimes I happen, many times happen, that to each other we look at each other to say, what do you think? What do you think? You like it? We can do better to each other. No one was more or less than the other one, you know, because we are we were family collaborating, one goal, make it good, may sound good, and everybody can have one ear, one one idea, one feelings. Maybe something can get missed by because I was too con maybe the singer is too concentrated, so it probably can miss maybe something. The producer, maybe it's over overloading and so needing another opinion. Because when you work with super professional people, that's not that the things that I mean that to who you are, you can talk, doesn't exist. We become a global family collaboration. So, yes, we say to each other, what do you think? Do you like it? Numa, do you like it? Do you think I can do it again? Or I don't know, I have a feeling that there is a how many times I had a feeling to hear something that in the track was not was not singing, was not sounding perfectly. And I took a responsibility to open all the tracks, you know, and yes, in the bottom there was a maybe a bass line or was uh uh a piano that was maybe doing uh a co a chord that was not the right one. Yes, I took all the responsibility, but I felt easy to uh to say because nobody was with the gun. Because we talking with people because they're big, they are to they don't have to overbear nobody. In the other side, I have to tell you that also, yes, I I worked, collaborated with people, they were the opposite. Yes, they were arrogant, they were overbearing, they were nasty, but not not these names, not these people that we just mentioned, other people that were pretty horrible, and work with them wasn't a help. But not them.

SPEAKER_01 39:52

My dog is every you perform Promised Land. I loved it. I checked it out. Written by Phil Palmer, Paul Bliss, as part of a humanitarian, humanitarian project supporting people fleeing poverty and war. UNICEF supported the official video project and the related Italian initiative. I don't know how to pronounce it, so I don't want to jack it up. Pronounce it for me.

SPEAKER_00 40:18

No isia mamore, Noisia Mamore Love is the Italian version and the English version is Promise Land. By the way, the song has also been given to us by Justin Howard. That in America I know that in that in that time, in old days, uh, Justin Howard was uh extremely famous with Moody Blues. I know, I know, and and that song belonged to Justin Howard too, which in America again was extremely famous. Uh so it's an amazing huge collaboration and efforts to give this anthem to uh Unicef, the um international and national. We together the video clip, very very meaningful, because in the video clip there was there were yeah, I invite people to look the video clip Promised Land. There are the official images of UNICEF, which you can see, real images, no AI guys, which you can see the boot camp, no the place where they do all the um uh aid for the for for the for for mom and children uh under the bombs, and they risk their own life just to cure, to save people, uh, because they're physically under the the war, under the bomb. So you can see the real images. Unfortunately, once again, now everything you see, you can think that's been created, manufacturing, you know. But that that images will come come came to us many years ago so real. And so there are in the video clip very interesting to listen to the song, listen the meaning, understand that it's an anthem, is the way you know music can really you know make heart vibrate it and make feel make you feel the brotherhood, make you feel the energy that we can we can be united in the heart, in a belief. And it's powerful when people sing together, walk together, hold each other's hands and united in a belief of the peace. Uh and once again, we decided finally to don't look, to turn our head and the other side, but look and see what's going on around us. Because one is just enough to give knowledge of what's going on in the world, to already step in action is nothing worse than turn your your head another side, to don't give that knowledge. But just when you sing and and and and mention and and call uh the the truth and and the love and the peace, it's already, believe me, it's already a lot, energetically speaking, because it's an awakeness that matter, matter, matter, even if you cannot go on the feel and physically, I don't know, do something, but already your knowledge, your heart, your voice matter. And the music's powerful.

SPEAKER_01 42:57

Yeah, it is. That and it it connected personally for me because I've been to war, you know. So I s you know, when I when people say the word casually, I don't hear headline. I see people, families, you know, fair, the children, things you don't forget. So, you know, you know, did working around Promised Land change the way you understood displacement, people leaving everything behind? True.

SPEAKER_00 43:22

It's so tragic. And uh at least to give a bit of knowledge. Once again, we're not for who cannot do nothing. We cannot give give money, we cannot go on the field physically, but we can give a knowledge and knowledge to say, I see you, I hear you, I think for you, I mention you, I I see at least uh I know that you exist and you that you're suffering and you're in pain and you're in the risk. I don't want to turn my head on the other side. And once again, the music is very powerful, the lyrics are very powerful. That's why I always invite my colleagues to stop to use the music just. To be in their personal shouts. You know what I mean? Personal rambling shouts or what they don't like, what they don't they they're gonna, what they I mean, and so kids they have different words shouting in their heads all the time when they are in the traffic, in the cars, and just listen, blah blah blah blah blah blah. My mother didn't love me and blah blah blah blah blah. The society is horrible, and then blah blah blah blah, I'm gonna kill you, gonna punch you, gonna watch it world. Uh and what horrible hypnosis that just I mean poisoned the minds, and it made people blind, it made people rage, it made people, you know what, powerless, fool just to rage. That's the wrong music to listen. You know idea how much is powerful that music. You know idea how much how much bad bad blood causes inside you. You know idea, you know what, you know what? You know idea it can also cause you disease.

SPEAKER_01 45:03

And you know what?

SPEAKER_00 45:05

Because uh your your immune system shut down. Definitely because the because the rage and the and and and and the and the and the and the power and feel powerless, uh feel angry, no, feel uh bitter, shut down your your immune system. And then you if it if tomorrow you have a flu, and I say flu because I want to be nice, I don't want to say something worse. Don't wonder, don't wonder. Yes, you're gonna tell me, Numa. Then now I get the flu, I get uh the disease because I listened to wrong music. I tell you that it's a good component because the energy and the power of the music, the hidden one, the supple one, the one that you don't see, but you just uh receive in your heart and in your skin and your chemical reaction, in your neurons, you know what I'm powerful. And you keep listening around music, full of rage, full of anger, full of, you know, I don't like that, I don't like that, I hate this, uh, full of swearing, horrible words. Keep doing it and let's see what happens in five years, two years' time, five years' time. If you go back home and you fight with everybody, or you lose your job, or you become angry with people, or you have bad reactions, and then you get you get bad feedbacks. Don't wonder. Wake up because you you are poisoning yourself with the wrong inspiration, with the wrong pushing, with the with the wrong energy. Don't underestimate the power of the music.

SPEAKER_01 46:30

You're so you're so passionate. I feel everything you're talking about, and you mean it, you know. So thank you, thank you. I'm wondering, has there what was the loneliest, loneliest moment of your career? This one. This one? Oh no, talk it to me. It's the loneliest moment of your career.

SPEAKER_00 46:50

Oh my love. I don't know. I tell you why, I tell you why, I tell you why, I tell you why what I mean.

SPEAKER_01 46:56

I tell you, yes, please, you have to tell me.

SPEAKER_00 46:59

It's because um I am uh in one of the most probably biggest. I need to find the English words because uh I'm sitting in Italian the starter speaking in the start of speaking English. Um I'm in a moment on quantum leap. So is that makes sense to you? And when you make a quantum leap, most of the time you're on your own. You're very lonely. Because uh it's just you you can feel that you are that close, that you are in that edge. And sometimes you once again you have to do all on your own. Because once again there's nobody to help you, really. They want to take you on that responsibility and that commitment, especially because they see you on charge. You know what I mean? You feel they feel you that understand that you are your person that has uh the direction on my life, they have uh the kind of power on my life, the kind of uh, I mean, beliefs and strength. Sometimes people think that I don't need nothing. We all need something. We may, I mean we're human, but our life is sharing, our life is collaborations, our life is brotherhood, our life is love each other, help each other, give to each other something. We don't, we we is that it's wrong to think who think that we are just one person, that we're separated by the other one. It's delusional thought that we could possibly have. We can have our own responsibility, we can stay we stay in our in our power, yes, we can take our own decision, we can take the full responsibility of what's going on in our life, yes. But we're not separated by the rest of the world, you know what I mean? So, yes, we do have we we don't we don't need sharing collaboration and support, yes. And so um I still struggle to find uh uh partners. I mean, uh really that really I can do uh the quantum leap very big that I want to do. I want to bring people with me. Not just on my own. Not just because I want I'm not, I mean, I don't want to be the w the sole winner. I don't know, I want I want I want that all my family is going to win with me. I uh actually our our win, our one, our our victory is when the audience, when we're giving something that matter that can give an impact to our audience. The people can cry or tears for joy, the people applaud, the people jump on the chair, the people make some changes and uh and and and come to your gigs or just simply contact you on Instagram or just download your song and sing aloud in the car. Or people like you invite me for important interviews so we can share the words to the rest of the people. I mean, I'm that close or what the biggest fan to leap on my life. Yes, and I think it would be lovely.

SPEAKER_01 49:41

I I love that. I love that. Thank you for explaining it. So who do you call when you need empowerment?

SPEAKER_00 49:47

The universe. It's my boss, my management, my manager.

SPEAKER_01 49:51

Your manager, the universe. Okay, okay, honestly. Short and sweet. Yeah, I love that, Numa.

SPEAKER_00 49:57

So this is my manager.

SPEAKER_01 50:00

My boss everything you said, it makes sense. So this show is called We're All Recovering. And recovering doesn't only mean addiction, you know. Some people get that twisted. People recover from grief, war, trauma, failure, heartbreak, shame, childhood, success.

SPEAKER_00 50:18

Sometimes I have it all.

SPEAKER_01 50:20

Right.

SPEAKER_00 50:21

I I have it all. I I'm really part of the family. I can promise you. Lost my mother, lost my father, lost my dog, lost my brother, lost my cat. All in this here. And um and my father always had a when he was young, a terrible addiction with drugs for all his life. I mean, the first part of his life, because then he he really recovered. He turned into being an amazing man, but just the last 10 years of his life. And so when he was uh drug addicted and was um was another person, and so for that part of his life I was a terrible father. So I've been through something very big, very horrible. And so I know what drug can do, I know what addiction can do. That's why I'm alcohol-free and drug-free and vegan and all these stuff, these things, because I try to put me to to save my life, to save my soul. Not because I feel me better the other one. I actually I try to to help people to to find the same strength and just try to protect me, protect my soul. But I know what that's me.

SPEAKER_01 51:21

That's powerful, and I could tell that you genuinely love yourself today, you know. I love that.

SPEAKER_00 51:29

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 51:31

Today, was that always true though? Was that always true?

SPEAKER_00 51:35

Yeah, yeah. I come today, yeah, with all my heart, but but but not before, obviously. For all my youth, I was convinced that I was really something wrong with me. Because I didn't say I say I have to be really stupid. I have to be really um really not worthy because all the Hollywood things happen to me all the time. People that disrespect me in that way. I think I must be oh, I must be stupid, or probably I don't worth nothing. So it's right. I mean, that someone steal me the job because uh I don't take drugs or because I don't have sex, so I shouldn't probably. I mean, I should be a slave of someone because probably that's what I'm worth. I mean, I've been through the hell. I mean, with the father, they remind me every day that I was nothing, worth nothing, and uh that I will never succeed. And I was uh oh I need a mama, I'm wondering, uh I knew he was gonna come sooner or later. So when you know when you have a father that every single day of their life tell you that you don't worth nothing, and you will never succeed, and then you were never you were never made it, and you you're not good in nothing, you know, beautiful enough, you know, good enough, you know, elegant enough, you know, good looking enough, you know, you don't sing good enough. Well, come on. Yes, I mean uh I mean for half half part of my life I thought to worth nothing. Zero.

SPEAKER_01 53:01

So Numa, eventually there's gonna come a time, no next single, you know, no next television appearance, no next Letting come with us.

SPEAKER_00 53:10

Come baby with us.

SPEAKER_01 53:12

He wants to ask you some questions, too.

SPEAKER_00 53:14

Of course, my love. You have to be part of us. Come with us, come with us.

SPEAKER_01 53:17

He wants to be a part of everything, he wants to be a part of everything.

SPEAKER_00 53:20

Has to be.

SPEAKER_01 53:22

So there's gonna be no, you know, no next interview, you know, no applause. All any of us leave behind, you know, is what our life meant to somebody else. When people someday say Numa Palmer was here, what do you hope they say next?

SPEAKER_00 53:38

I hope they say that they feel close to me. As you say in English, they heard me, they felt they felt me in their heart. They felt me like a sister, they felt me like a I mean, like a part of their life. They felt me in their heart. Yes, like like a sister. That kind of uh of um familiarity, you know, close to me. Uh and they felt close to me. And I hope that who is listening to us today, first of all, they kind of take take taking something, especially regarding the quality of the messages of the voice or the or the music of the or the message of the love, to choose not to choose the love, we don't choose the hate. So I hope they were taking something on board. I hope that they will never give up. They've just felt like a you know, like a kind of cold, a kind of push from these words. It would be amazing. That would be amazing. And I hope they also they're going to look up uh on me if they want to, because they can stay in touch with me if they want to. And so they just can reach me out in Instagram, YouTube, or whatever, because now we have this uh, you know, yeah, we have these uh tools, and I would be there for them because I do sleep at night sometimes to answer to friends, followers, a fan, or whatever you want to call them, people, yeah, yeah, human, human being, human being that just want to be in contact with me, and I always there for them. No, even after sleep at night.

SPEAKER_01 55:01

That's beautiful, that's beautiful, you know. Because some, you know, that's a legacy. Not how many people knew your name, but how many people were different because you was here, you know. So I love that. And Numa, you know, this was the conversation I wanted today. You know, we talked about the music business, you know, the pressure, power, love, feel, humanitarian work, your success, pain. And the human being underneath it all. Before we get out of here, tell everybody where they can find your music and what you're working on next.

SPEAKER_00 55:33

Okay. So, my friends and families out there. You can find me. You have to remember my name, first of all. Remember my name. You say that you say the song of fame. Fame. I wanna live forever. And um, I wanna learn how to fly. Beautiful words. So um you can remember Numa and uh Uma Palmer, Numa Palmer, and then you just go online on Spotify, on YouTube, on uh Instagram, type Numa Palmer, and then join me. Join me. Apple Music. Yes, Apple Music, everywhere, and just just listen to my music because uh you're gonna find any kind of music, which I'm very proud, because I define myself pretty eclectic. Because, for example, uh I I wrote songs with a very deep meanings, with a very deep uh deep deep lyrics, and also I played amusing songs, more not shallow, just simply lighter, more dense, which people can really just uh you know what I mean, dance and move his body and feel free to feel you know. I tell you what, okay, I want to say something to the studio. This last little thing. I wrote three or two or three songs that was talking about the sensuality of the other of the other women. What I wanna say with this. Many women, especially the grown-up one, they start to think that they're not beautiful anymore, they don't deserve anymore to be loved, to be sexy, to be beautiful, to have uh, you know, that kind of uh um I can explain you um the kind of emotion, emotion, the kind of sparkle or and and uh I want to say to this woman that there's we don't we don't we don't aspire, you know what I mean? We don't have the date, the date of the that we aspire, the love, uh the passion, or the physical love also. It's not it that doesn't expire. We don't have to renounce to believe that we can feel feel ourselves beautiful, desired, and fit, or you know what I mean, or a little bit, you know, also a little bit free. You know what I mean, free to to express what what we feel. And that that's why I wrote these two, three songs that are a little bit more happy and light when I talk about follow your desire, feel yourself beautiful, let yourself go if you feel in love, let yourself, your body go if you feel that you won't have uh some physical attraction, but has to be beautiful and respectful and happy and joyful to me. And also try to give also this kind of empowerment to the women, okay? To don't think to be old for the love, for the attraction, for the desire, you know, for the kind of moment that um I mean we don't have to feel ashamed to want to be still beautiful or attractive or fit or whatever it is, you know, in love again, you know me, or desired again. So I've wrote the last two, three songs uh they were the type a little bit light and happy, truthful, uh sensual for this purpose. There was a real meaning why I did it. It was not just for marketing reason reason at all. There was this meaning.

SPEAKER_01 58:52

I can't wait to hear it now. I I can't wait to hear one is called desire.

SPEAKER_00 58:56

In fact, it's a you my desire, and this uh I feel I feel me like in a spell, in a spell of love, because I feel this attraction which I want to let myself go. And trust of this beautiful sparkle of uh uh emotion. I mean, it's uh it's to to make you dance under the moon.

SPEAKER_01 59:15

Just feel feel this kind of uh that sounds nice dancing under the moon. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 59:22

The song is called Make Love to Me, for example, which uh sounds if you see you if you hear the song is pretty sensual, I have to tell you. Did deliberately I want it, I want it to be like that. I want to sing uh in a very sensual way, but the song says enough hate, enough war, make love to me. Let's make love. I mean it's uh it's a dance song, so it doesn't have much lyrics because it's a dance song, so it is not full of uh thousand meaning on thousand words because it is EDM songs, so it's proper electric dance music. But three words are clear enough, enough war, enough hate, make love to me. So you know, even when you very very I mean when you're very short, I don't I don't have I don't I don't betray, you know what I mean, my my soul and then the meaning of what I want to say.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:11

I understand.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:11

Yeah, and some other songs instead are have proper lyrics, proper story. One one song is called Stronger, Stronger. Their lyrics are amazing. Honestly, that lyrics, if you listen to the song Stronger, Numa, Numa Palmer Stronger. I'm so proud of that lyrics. That song tells you exactly how to survive, how burn again from your hushes, from the pain, be strong and uh and and and and and start a new life from just from thanks to your strength.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:40

Desire stronger and make love to me. I'm looking them all up. I'm looking them all up for you.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:46

You know, another song is called G Never Give Up. You can't forget this and never give up. I love it. I love the titles.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:52

I love the titles. They say I love them.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:55

So exactly. So I invite people just to join me, to listen to my music, to comment, to come back to me, to tell me I like that.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:02

There you go.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:03

Yeah, so come back to me, like give me your feedback, and you would be you would make me very, very happy.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:08

Yes, ma'am. Numa Palmer, folks. There you have it. And thank you, Numa, for coming and and gracing us with your presence and sharing your story. And to everybody, thanks for tuning in. Check out Numa Palmer. I'll have it all down in the description so you can find her, her links, and everything you need. And I'll go check out on Spotify, Apple Music, all the music stuff. Even Amazon, probably, you know, Amazon too, right? They have a music thing too.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:37

I think I'm everywhere.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:38

Yeah, everywhere. Amazon have a music.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:42

Because in YouTube there are my video clips that I'm so proud. They're so beautiful. My video clips. I I say this to myself because I they are very amazing. No AI, guys. It's a proper movies that we're recording in weeks and weeks and weeks and a lot of investments and have go to look to watch the video clips because I'm amazing. Stronger and never give up are the amazing, beautiful video clips. Remember, Numa Palmer. Go and let me know.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:08

Numa Palmer. There you go. Thank you, Numa, for coming. And to everybody for tuning in. Till next time. It's war. Each one reach one. We're all recovering. Peace.